Christians in Algeria

[voltaire]

Sorry but guys, this is just silly.

So... you're willing to tolerate other religions as long as they don't ask you to consider changing to their beliefs? Funny how I've never read a thread on this board objecting to people converting to Islam in the West.

Still, I guess that's "different", right?

I mean Jeez, BB, "protect the children" from what? From choice?



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[Al-khiyal]

There is a world of difference between voluntary reversion to Islam and proselytizing ya voltaire. And as has been pointed out - where is the 'pluralist, multiculturalist tolerance' in a mindset that says that Muslims are lost and need to be 'converted'? Where is the acceptance there?

You cannot have two cases - that of arguing for pluralism while at the same time defending an activity that would, if it succeeded in its aims, eradicate Islam in Algeria.

[voltaire]

Yeah, 'cos that's how it works, right Al-K: do you seriously think that every Muslim convert in the west does so "voluntarily" (ie without anyone asking them to do so), whereas every Christian convert in Algeria is forced somehow?

We both know that's not true.



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[Al-khiyal]

That's an evasion ya voltaire, it overlooks the fact that there IS substantial voluntary reversion to Islam in the West, for one thing. It also overlooks the fact that under Algerian law it is a criminal offense to attempt to induce a Muslim to adopt another religion.

You seem to have shifted from some 'tolerant, multiculturalist' ideal towards advocating a kind of 'free for all' where religion is just another commodity to be subject to competition and 'poaching' is fair game.

Taken to their logical conclusion, proselytizing efforts seek the eradication of other religious beliefs. No 'live and let live' there, eh?

There is a small (and dwindling) Christian community in Algeria. Some recent statistics suggest that Christians and Jews only account for some 1% of the population there. Surely Christians would be better tending to their own flocks without resorting to seeking recruits from among Algeria's Muslims? Apart from the legal position, such activities only lead to friction.

[voltaire]

That's an evasion ya voltaire, it overlooks the fact that there IS substantial voluntary reversion to Islam in the West, for one thing. It also overlooks the fact that under Algerian law it is a criminal offense to attempt to induce a Muslim to adopt another religion.

You seem to have shifted from some 'tolerant, multiculturalist' ideal towards advocating a kind of 'free for all' where religion is just another commodity to be subject to competition and 'poaching' is fair game.

Taken to their logical conclusion, proselytizing efforts seek the eradication of other religious beliefs. No 'live and let live' there, eh?

There is a small (and dwindling) Christian community in Algeria. Some recent statistics suggest that Christians and Jews only account for some 1% of the population there. Surely Christians would be better tending to their own flocks without resorting to seeking recruits from among Algeria's Muslims? Apart from the legal position, such activities only lead to friction.

Right - firstly, so-called "reversion" is a loaded term, as you know.

Secondly, people convert from Islam to Christianity, and from Christianity to Islam, across the world, and they do so (in both directions) both volutarily and due to evangelism, largely at the same time - precisely because the two are not mutually exclusive. Most people convert from one religion to another because they're asked. There's nothing morally wrong with that, whichever the source or destination.

What there is, is a double standard, which you're beginning to exhibit.

Thirdly, if Algerian law prohibits Muslims from adopting another religion, then Algerian law is bigoted. And you know it, so stop tacking.

Finally, it is hardly surprising that the Christian community in Algeria is struggling, if it is discriminated against in state law in the manner that you describe. And after all, there would be no need for such bigoted laws if people were not worried about potential conversions, would there?



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[Al-khiyal]

You're offering some abstract arguments without, evidently, having paid much actual attention to Algerian society. There is a context to the introduction of particular laws in Algeria, it has been posted about here before and is not the simplistic 'bigotry' that you are trying to reduce it to. I suggest that you take a look at context before slipping into a black and white view of a world that is a lot more complex than that.

[voltaire]

And he calls me evasive, lol...

If there was a law in the UK that said Muslim organisations could not ask people to cease being Christians and convert to Islam, then you would be hopping up and down (or rather, doubtless, quoting press articles that you thought reflected your view) saying that this was evidence of Islamophobic bigotry.

But of course, when the national context differs, and it's a matter of laws barring people from asking Muslims to change religion, then that's all about "context", and is not bigoted at all. Yeah, wotteva.



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