Response dedicated to SABAH

[Giovanni]

Hello Sabah

The reason I dont ask Imams question is Simple. The majority of Imams whom I know of(with the Exception of 1 Sufi Imam I met in PERSON) ARE ORTHODON MUSLIMS. This means they follow SUNNAH ans HADITH. I reject those docterains CONPLETLY. Ive talked to many "orthodox Muslims"(muslims refer to this group of people as PRACTICING MUSLIMS.....)Their knowlege is based primarily on the sunnah and Hadith....They look for answers for questions with those books INSTEAD of The Quran.Then when I tell them I REJECT THE answer(because of its source) they try CONVINCING ME that the SUNNAh ans HADITH are VALId when its not.

Thats the reason I dont go.I want answers...not someone who will try to convice me the SUNNAH and HADITH are valid. Besides....Ive rejected the Quran as beeing the FINAL WORD OF GOD. I no longer reconize it at all as having any spiritual valididity.

Another reason I dont go is because I dont feel like having someone try to convince me thatI should convert to ISLAM (especially since I almost did once).ITS SO ANOYING!!MUslims ARE worse than JEHOVAH"S WITNESSES SOMETIMES!

I argued with a specific person for 8 months (who i do not name) who INSISTED that SUNNAH AND HADITH were valid....This same person INSISTED for me to see a very FAMOUS Imam in the MUslim comunity in Montreal.THis person also said"if once isnt good then go 2 or 3 times".At first i agreeed...but now I DONT THINK SO.The reason the person wanted me to go see this IMAM was to try to "make me understand why sunnah and Hadith are valid". In reality...they were hoping that by me going more then once I would EVENTUALLY accept HIS reasons.I feel i was beeing set up to be BRAIN WASHED IN ACCEPTING THE ORTHODOX WAYS OF WORSHIP>(in my opinion)

NO THANK YOU!!

Because of this person I promised myself I would NEVER AGAIN enter a MOSQUE IN WHICH THE MAJORITY OF PEOPLE ARE ORTHODOX..Ive broken promisses befoe....but this one I INTEND TO KEEP.(I will only enter the SUFI MOSQUES)

I reject ISLAM as beeing THE RELIGION of GOD because Islam means "to submit to GOD" Christianity and Judaism are also base on this Concept. But ISLAM worships ALLAH by using MAN MADE LAWS OF THE sunnah and Hadith. How can you say you submit to Allah if you dont know his words?(THATS WHY I AM NO LONGER CATHOLIC AND CANT CONVERT TO ISLAM) You only know the interpretations of words give by IMAMS,HADITHS and THE SUNNAH.,

I also reject the QURAn as being the FINAL WORD OF GOD as well as SUNNAH and HADITH.

What would I BE DOING in an ORTHODOX MOSQUE or with an IMAM?I reject his entire religious phylosophy.I accept him as being a human being willing to help me and a knowlegeable person BUT ONLY IN THE WAYS OF MAN NOT GOD because he uses SUnnah and Hadith.

I will be posting something soon entitled "contradictions in the QURAN"Ive found a number of them.

The majority of my posts are not realy Questions...But rather answers to questions...or my answer to the question in my opinion which are in the Quran or Bible.

I posted a number of things online in order to show how I view certain things..or to inform people about what the QURAN SAYS......MOST MUSLIMS use Sunnah and Hadith instead of the Quran(refered to as the BOOK)they dont know its contents..THEY CAN READ IT IN ARABIC..BUT THEY CANT UNDERSTAND WHAT THEY ARE READING.(3/4ths of the MUSLIM POPULATION IS NOT ARAB SPEAKING) Those who are extrem(like the person i mentioned above) sometimes REFUSE to read an ENGLISH QURAN because its not"THE ORIGINAL TEXT".Therefore if i prove them wrong they say"its invalid because its not in ARABIC." "ITS NOT THE REAL QURAN!!"

IM SORRY BUT...wether its in arabic or english....THE MEANING OF THE WORDS ARE THE SAME.

If islam is one of the people of the Book...WHY DONT THEY USE IT OR ONLY IT?They use Hadith and Sunnah instead.Why do they follow laws which CONTRADICT or have NO QURANIC reference?

I ACTUALLY HAVE THE ANSWER TO THIS. THEY(THOSE WHO FOLLOW SUNNAH AND HADITH) QUOTE THE FOLLOWING SURAH TO PROVE THE VALIDIDITY OF THE SUNNAH AND HADITH:

Quran 33:36
"It is not fitting for a Believer man or woman when a matter has been decided by Allah and His Apostle to have any option about their decision: if anyone disobeys Allah and His Apostle he is indeed on a clearly wrong Path."
59:7
"...So take what the Apostle assigns to you and deny yourselves that which he withholds from you. And fear Allah; for Allah is strict in Punishment."

THE RESOPNSE I GIVE TO THE ABOVE QUOTE IS THE FOLLOWING(ALONG WITH THE SURA)

What God forbids is in the Quran and NO OTHER source....Yes we must not do what the prophet says is wrong..HOWEVER what is forbidden is Clearly marked in the Quran.
Muhammed came to DELIVER the Quran of God...not his own teachings or interpretations of God's will

HERE IS THE SURAH WHICH PROVES MY STATEMEBT:

[5:99] The sole duty of the messenger is to deliver the message, and GOD knows everything you declare and everything you conceal

NOTICE "THE MESSAGE" and not "HIS INTERPRETATION OF" THE MESSAGE or his "IMPUT" on the message.

further more Allah says that his word is COMPLETE...therefore why do we need anyone to interpret his laws or ADD ANYTHING TO THEM IF THEY ARE COMPLETE?

[6:114] Shall I seek other than GOD as a source of law, when He has revealed to you this book fully detailed? Those who received the scripture recognize that it has been revealed from your Lord, truthfully. You shall not harbor any doubt.

[6:115] The word of your Lord is complete, in truth and justice. Nothing shall abrogate His words. He is the Hearer, the Omniscient.

Prophet muhammed is also FORBIDEN to deliver any OTHER MESSAGE BESIDES THE QURAN because his perpose is to deliver the QURAN and ONLY the Quran.Notice in 64:12 GOD says "THE MESSAGE " and not the message of the prophet. In otherwards the Word of GOD ONLY

[64:12] Obey God and obey the messenger.: but If you shall turn away, the duty Of Our Messenger is but To deliver(the message) clearly and openly

[69:44] Had he uttered any other teachings.
[69:45] We would have punished him.
[69:46] We would have stopped the revelations to him.
[69:47] None of you could have helped him.

MOHAMED IS FORBIDEN TO SAY OR DELIVER ANYTHING ACCEPT THE QURAN ACCORDING THE ABOVE AYAS!!

THE SUNNAH AND HADITH ARE NOT REVELATIONS OF GOD,,,,,RATHER INTERPRETATIONS OF THE WORD OF ALLAH. MOHAMED WAS FORBIDEN TO SAY,INTERPRET OR DELIVER ANYTHING ELSE BESIDES THE QURAN.

THEREFORE FOR THOSE WHO FOLLOW OTHER THINGS BESIDEDS THE QURAN(IF YOU ARE MUSILIM)IT IS WRITEN IN YOUR SACRED SCRIPTURE:

[5:44]....... Therefore, do not reverence human beings; you shall reverence Me instead. And do not trade away My revelations for a cheap price. Those who do not rule in accordance with GOD's revelations are the disbelievers.

REREAD THAT AYA "THOSE WHO DO NOT RULE ACCORDING TO GOD"S REVELATIONS" HOW CAN YOU RULE ACCORDING TO ALLAH"S REVELATIONS IF 90% OF YOUR KNOWLEGE IS NOT FROM THE QURAN?


The question AND ANSWERS I just asked AND ANSWERED is inteanded for all muslims on the internet.

One of my previous posts EXPLAIN WHY people should not follow the Sunnah and Hadith.ONLY THE QURAN.Have you read it?PLEASE DO....ive shown THE CONTRADICTIONs. IF the sunnah WAS REALY DEVINELY INSPIRED IT SHOULD NOT CONTRADICT THE MAIN SACRED TEXT(QURAN)

YOU HAVE TO ADMIT...IVE MADE A STRONG ARGUMENT SO FAR...WITH PROOF.

I will be posting something soon entitled "contradictions in the QURAN"Ive found a number of them WITH QURANIC SUPPORT.

I hope this answers your question...if you have more questions dont hesitate to ask away

SAALAM SISTER

MAY ALLAH GUIDE YOU IN HIS WAYS AND WITH HIS LAWS.

PS: everything i wrote here was either (1) in my opinion (2) with quranic support. Nothing here is intended to ofend anyone but rather TO INFORM THEM IN THE WAYS OF ALLAH(or rather in the muslim ways of ALLAH ACCORDING TO THE QURAN)

[Sabah]

Salam Johnny,

I can understand your confusion...Islam is not a religion, it is a way of life. You say you have studied Islam for 8 months...some people study it for a life time and still are not fully knowledgeable. You have just touched the surface.

How many Imams do you really know? Second of all, there is no such thing as Orthodox Islam, you're either Muslim or you're not.

Thirdly, you are generalizing and being prejudiced-things that are apparently contradictions to your current faith and way of life.

Fourthly, it's not called brainwashing, it's called educating. Are you going to school and being brainwashed? They're telling you stuff that you don't know about...is that brainwashing? You cannot make assumptions on people's intentions without knowing what is in their heart and there is no way of knowing that.

We are supposed to be living in an open and accepting society, however, as much I hate to say this, your last post has really upset me and shown me nothing but ignorance,stubborness and Eurocentrism. You have judged Islam and all of it's followers on a misunderstanding.

As for the Qur'an...no, it's words cannot be translated exactly into enlgish or any other language. The english language is much too limited to express the essence of the Qur'an. That is why Muslims must read it in Arabic (whether they understand or not), the fact of reading it in it's intended form is a spiritual journey for the mind.

Now, about not going to see an Imaam because he believes in Hadith and Sunnah is absolutely ridiculous. You are condemning a person before knowing them, meeting them, talking to them. Maybe if you actually gave them the chance to explain, you wouldn't be so confused.

I'm sorry Johnny, but you've disappointed me immensly...I
really didn't think you were like that. I was so happy to meet someone so open minded and rational as you...but I was decieved.

I am sorry for that,
Have a nice day

[Giovanni]

You are right..Islam is a way of life.....but not according to the Quran..but rather according to the SUNNAH and HADITH.

Secondly...I do not dislike muslims..as a matter of a fact I know more muslims than I have ever known.And many people I know are muslim. They are rightiouss, intelegent and very clean people.Their faith is strong. And i respect that very much....but i dont accept the aspects OF ISLAM dealing with ORTHODOXISM!.I feel too many things have just dont add up.

You said either your muslim or your not. I say your either (1)a MUSLIm who follows the WORD of GOD or(2) A MUSLIM who follows MAN MADE LAWS.Its the individuals choice what they practice..Wether they are orthodox or not, practicing or not..they are human beings. I dont see muslims,Christians or jews;i see humans.I respect that very much..

BUT i am stating is that i dont AGREE WITH ORTHODOX MENTALITY PERTAING TO MAN MADE LAWS.THATS ALL

I have not prejudged any muslim.....but i have had a number of bad experiences with a few of them.That doesnt mean they are all the same.Wether they are orthodox or not I accept them as human beings ..but not their phylosophy on ORTHODOX MAN MADE LAWS.THATS ALL. I HAVE RIGHT NOT TO HAVE THE SAME PHYLOSOPHIES AS MUSLIMS!

BY proving myself RIGHT with the Quran does not make me stoborn...rather it shows that i know whats WRITEN in the Quran.May i ask you..do you know whats writen it it?You repeat the words of the IMAMS by saying "its not the REAL QURAN" Pick one up and read it.Once you do that..TELL ME IF YOUR SUNNAH AND HADITH COMPLY WITH THE QURAN. You''ll see,it doesnt. If it does i am willing to take back what i have said which has offenede you.

You rely on your IMAMS for answwr instead of LOOKING for them yourself.I use to do the same as you. I usee to ask the PRIESTS ALL THE TIME. Then I realised by reading the bible that THEY WERE CONTRADICTING THE BIBLE 80% of the time. Everything about the CATHOLIC CHURCH IS BASICALLY MAN MADE.THE SAME THING HAPPENED WHEN I READ THE QURAN and talked to the "orthodox muslims". They answered me and i would quote the quran which CONTRADICTED WHAT THEY WERE SAYING!!YOu have to read,get informed...THEN TALK TO THE IMAMS and priests.

REligion or spiritual life is not about reciting from a book verse by verse..ITS ABOUT THE HEART. Pray from the heart act with the heart.THATS ALL. You have to feel God when you pray or talk about him. BY hating HINDUS or JEWS wont get you anywhere.

I dont hate anyone..as a matter of a fact if a HINDU asked me to join him/her for a religious meal I WOULD BE VERY HAPPY TO PARTICIPATE.

From my understading most muslims claim to know the quran..but they dont understand what they read.They read it in a language they cant understand.Does that make sense to you?

TRY TO LOOK AT IT FROM MY SIDE...

I am simply stating my opinion. I am very insistant when it comes to the WORD OF GOD I DO NOT BELIEVE IN DIVIATING FROM IT IN ANYWAY.I pray for those who persecute me and i turn the other cheek. THATS JUST WHO I AM.

I have been to a mosque, a buddist temple and a synagog. Ive talked to RABBIS,IMAMS,PRIESTS AND MONKS. I love to hear what people have to say and im always willing to hear or try to understand..BUT I DONT LIKE PEOPLE TRYING TO CHANGE WHO I AM TO SUIT THEM!AND MANY HAVE TRIED...ESPECIALLY THOSE WHO CLAIMED THEY LOVE ME! WHEN I DID NOT CONFORM WITH THEIR IDEAS OR DID EXACLYT WHAT THEY SAID HOW THEY SAID IT, OR WHEN I STARTED TO STAND UP FOR WHAT I BELIVED....I WAS DUMPED! IS THAT OPEN MINDED?

THAT SHOWS ME THE FOLLOWING"my way or the high way".I have always accepted people the way they are....never did i reject them...BUT that DOESNT MEAN I HAVE TO BELIEVE EXACTLY WHAT THEY BELIEVE! I accept them as human beings, or as friends.

DO YOU KNOW WHAT IT MEANS TO ACCPT SOMEONE HOW THEY ARE? IT means NOT TRYING TO CHANGE THEM. You may state your opinion or show them THE REASON YOU DONT ACCEPT AN IDEOLOGY BUT YOU HAVE NO RIGHT TO CHANGE THEM.

When i post things im showing what I BELIEVE WHICH I BACK UP WITH BIBLICAL OR QURANIC EVIDENCE.THATS ALL.

YOU REALIZE THAT I DONT BELIEVE EXACTLY WHAT YOU BELIEVE...and that IM not converting to ISLAM.It seems to piss you off.

ISLAM IS NOT FOR ME.I saw too many things that I could not accept because it contradicted itself.\

WHen i post "contradictions in the QURAN" you will realize the "perfect Quran" is not so perfect.

THe bible IS NOT PERFECT,NEITHER IS THE QURAN. ONLY GOD IS PERFECT.

Im seeking a religion who has my ideologies..who WORSHIPS GOD AND GOD ALONE. THE catholic religion IS FAR FROM THAT. SO IS ISLAM.

I dont know everything...and i dont want to know everything...but i can try to grasp and comprehend as much as i possibly can.

BUT im not seeing an IMAM!I HAVE MY REASONS!
WHY ARE YOU SO INSISTANT IN ME SEEING AN IMAM?

I love the muslim people, muslim art, arab food etc...ANd i accept islam as a religion..BUT NOT AS MY RELIGION and not as THE RELIGION OF GOD.

If i ofended you..then im truly sorry.That was not my intention.I was simply stating my opinion of the orthodox life, and i was answering your question.

Im not 2 faced..what i have to say i will say..and not behind someones back.I am FRANK.

I try to be as polite and descreet as posible...but when people force me to belive something or do something or try to change me..I HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT!

IM NOT SEEING AN IMAM.

Ive always been open minded....but i have the right NOT TO BE INFLUENCED BY SOMEONES ORTHODOX OPINION. I also have the right to my own opinion WETHER IT CONFORMS WITH ISLAM OR NOT.

ANSWER ME THIS:

IS JIHAD A WAY OF LIFE?DO YOU KNOW WHY SPAIN WAS CONQORED? trust me it was EVERYTHING BUT HOLY!

\MUSLIMS say CATHOLICS ARE PAGANS because they bow down at statues. IS PRAYING 5 times a day(facing the kaaba) TO A STONNE BUILDING ANY BETTER. HOW about kissing a ROCK when at the HAJJ? OR NOT KILLING SPIDERS BECAUSE IT SAVED THE PROPHETS LIFE.....HIDUS ARE CRITICISED FOR NOT KILLING COWS.

AND YOU SAY I PREJUDJE? I THINK I SHOULD BE DAM SCARED TO DEATH OF BEING BRAIN WASHED>

IF anyone is stoborn its not me. If anyone is narrow minded its not me.

I leave you with this proverb

"dont complain about the speck in my eye when you have a log in yours.Figure out how to remove your speck..then remove mine"

YOU know who said that? JESUS CHRIST(ISA)

HE WAS RIGHT!

I dont hate anyone..i dont reject anyone.But i do not bnelieve in the ORTHODOX SUNNAH HADITH MENTALITY.

I thought you were open minded as well.....you remind me of someone I KNEW WHO SAID THEY LOVED ME and LEFT ME because id didnt CONFORM with THEIR IDEAS..BECAUSE IT WASNT 100% ORTHODOX MUSLIM...OR BECAUSE THEY WERE UNSUCESSFUL IN CHANGING ME IN THEIR IMAGE.SOMEONE WHO SAID"I cant be with someone who is patriotic about italy because IT ISNT A MUSLIM COUNTRY!IT HAS THE VATICAN!"

SOMEONE WHO SAID"YOUR parents are nice..BUT THEY'RE Christian"

Someone who said "You know why CHRISTIANS dont get punished as SEVERELY AS MUSLIMS..BECAUSE THEY DONT KNOW BETTER"

TELL ME.....IS THIS WHAT YOU CALL OPENMINDED or NOT STUBORN?

BECAUSE I DONT ACCEPT YOUR RELIGIOUS DOCTERINS MEANS I DONT CONFORM WITH YOUR IDEAS.THATS ALL>

MY QUESTINS TO THE MUSLIM PEOPLE WERE FARE.MY QURANIC QUOTATIONS SUPPORTED WHAT I SAID. I SIMPLY STATED MY OPINION.

SORRY I DONT CONFORM TO YOUR IDEOLOGIES....OR BELIEVE EXACTLY WHAT YOU BELIEVE.

I realy thoght you were different

You also upset me with your "interpretation" of what i believe.You also decieved me.

Sorry i upset you...but dont judge me....TRY BEING IN MY SHOES after what i went through.TRUST ME...IT WASNT EASY!

Have a nice day